Give Your Kid a Knife with Heather Staller

Have you heard that you should have your kid help in the kitchen? Probably that it will help expose them to new foods, feel more comfortable with different foods, create independence. 

But maybe it also feels like a big chore. And when it comes to actually getting them there, it feels like a lot. The mess, the patience it takes, the kid who stirs once and disappears.

I get it! 

But what if it's actually not THAT big of a deal. 

Heather Staller is a trained chef, culinary school graduate, and the creator of Happy Kids Kitchen. She's spent years teaching kids of all ages to cook - in classrooms, in recreational cooking schools, in preschools - and her message to parents is simple: you don't need a recipe, a plan, or even a fully willing child. You just need one minute.

In this episode, we talk about:

• Why one minute in the kitchen genuinely counts - and how it adds up more than you'd expect
• The single most important skill to teach your kid first
• Why spreading is one of the most underrated kitchen skills - like spreading butter, peanut butter, jelly
• How to involve a kid who has zero interest in helping
• Where to start if you're not much of a cook yourself
• How getting kids comfortable in the kitchen helps with more than just nutrition

If you've ever wanted your child to be more capable and confident, in the kitchen and beyond, this episode will show you where to start.

RESOURCES MENTIONED: 

✅ Smoothie Download: The Smoothie Lab

✅ Blog Post: Teaching Knife Skills to Toddlers and Kids (Safety and Basics)

✅ Cookbook: Kid Kitchen 

✅ Instagram: @happykidskitchen

CONNECT with Nicole:

- Instagram: @nicolecruzRD
- Book a FREE Eating Alignment Call with Nicole to learn more about our approach and how we can work together: Eating Alignment Call

SUBSCRIBE & REVIEW:

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Your support helps us reach more conscious and loving parents who need these insight!

Thank you for tuning in and see you next week!

Transcript

SPEAKER_00 0:00

Welcome back to the intentional table. Today we have Heather Stoller of Happy Kids Kitchen on the podcast. Heather is a food blogger, recipe developer, and the voice behind Happy Kids Kitchen, where she helps busy families get kids involved in cooking. Through simple, kid-friendly recipes and practical tips, she encourages parents to build cooking skills, confidence, and positive relationships with food. Now, even though Heather went through culinary school and is well trained in the kitchen, she makes cooking with kids so simple and manageable. And that is what you are going to hear. She also helps us see the real importance of getting kids comfortable in the kitchen, yes, for nutrition, but even more for building their confidence and independence. I left this conversation feeling motivated and empowered. And I know that you will too. Welcome to the Intentional Table Podcast. This is where we go beyond nutrition to not only talk about how to help your child eat well and get the nutrients they need, but how to also support them in having a healthy relationship with food. If you want your child to eat a variety, listen to their body cues, eat the amount they need, and not be obsessed with sweets, or you just don't want to fight about food, you're in the right place. Here you'll find practical tips and compassionate guidance to support your family in navigating food with more joy and less stress. I'm Nicole Cruz, registered dietitian and mom of three, and I can't wait to dive in to today's episode with you. Hello, Heather, and welcome to the Intentional Table Podcast. I'm so happy to have you here today.

SPEAKER_01 1:44

Hi, Nicole. So excited to be here.

SPEAKER_00 1:47

I know. Thanks for joining us. This is so fantastic to get to chat a bit more about your arena where you work in the space of helping kids with food. So I would love if you could just start by sharing a little bit about the work that you currently do and how you support parents' families, kids around food.

SPEAKER_01 2:08

Yeah, so my main goal is to help parents get their kids in the kitchen and have a happy, healthy, and connected relationship through cooking together. And also I support parents through creating fun and engaging recipes to have their kids help with, but also just to make their life in the kitchen a little bit easier. So I kind of work with those two things.

SPEAKER_00 2:39

Yeah, I love that. And I love your Instagram. You're always posting such fun um and different recipes. And I have your cookbook too. And so we make stuff out of there. So I know that I know firsthand that you provide um some really valuable kitchen tools. Um, can you tell us a little bit about how you got into this work?

SPEAKER_01 2:58

I always loved cooking. It was a big part of my life as a kid as well. I really found kind of my creative voice and independence in my family when cooking. I really liked making certain things for my family and got a lot of positive feedback from that. And then I always really loved working with kids too. So I thought maybe after college I would become a teacher, an elementary school teacher, or I always really liked working with the preschool age too. So that was kind of my plan. But then my younger brother went to culinary school and in my senior year of college, and I was so jealous. So I was like, I guess if I'm that jealous, I gotta do it too. So I took a pause after college and went to a year of culinary school. And then in culinary school, they were asking me what I kind of wanted to do. And I thought, oh, why don't I combine my two loves of teaching and cooking? So after I graduated culinary school, I started teaching. Well, I did various other things, but I ended up teaching in a uh recreational cooking school that was both for adults and kids, but I really specialized in the kids doing workshops and camps. And one day my boss was like, Oh, you like little kids. Why don't you try the three to five-year-old class? And I had never really taught cooking of that age, but I ended up really loving it, and then I continued to work there doing that for a while. And then I had my own kids, and we kind of moved away from that school, but I was commuting a little bit back and forth, and the preschools where my kids were going were asking, Oh, do you want to do it here? So I ended up teaching a little bit in their classrooms, and then some other schools around wanted me to come in too. So that's kind of how I started my own business, like teaching in classrooms and then in recreational settings as well. Um, I did that for a while, and while I was doing that, I started my Instagram page, Happy Kids Kitchen, and then the website after that to have somewhere to post everything. And I really just started my Instagram to help other parents, um, especially with picky eaters, because I was getting so many questions, and also I was dealing with my own very resistant eater. My oldest son was a lot more challenging than I ever expected in the feeding arena. So I was really posting stuff about what I was feeding my kids and what I was doing in my classes, and it just kind of all snowballed from there.

SPEAKER_00 5:35

Yeah, all the pieces just kind of fit together to make it work. It's so great. And I'm curious because I know that we have talked about how having a healthy relationship with food is important too. And I think in this food world, it's really easy to go down a rabbit hole of like just make healthy foods and we have to sneak in vegetables and like follow my healthy recipes to get your kid to, you know, get so much protein and so much vegetables. So was there anything that like prompted you or what made you also want to be really thoughtful about the way that you're actually approaching food and to focus on also having a healthy relationship with food, not just you know, physical health at all costs, you know?

SPEAKER_01 6:20

Really tricky because I think when I first started out, I felt so much pressure um to really put like only like quote, health, really healthy foods, like focus on getting kids vegetables, like no sugar at all. And I know my friend and I were talking about the quote almond being almond moms when we were first starting to be parents and how much we've changed because we really, well, at least I saw that really backfire with my own kids. And at the same time, I was dealing with my own real relationship with food and really, you know, healing from a lot of diet culture and disordered eating, and really focusing on building a healthy relationship with food for myself, and I think the combination of those two things, really focusing on my relationship with food and wanting that for my kids, and also the restriction and the uh focus on you know, low sh no sugar and all of that for my kids. I saw that really backfiring and having negative effects on their relationship with food. So yeah, I think the combination of those two things really made me take and also following lots of dietitians and positive food voices on Instagram also really helped me, such as you. I found you, I think, pretty early on in my journey, and following you and similar accounts that were like, wait a minute, what are we really doing to our kids by being so focused on what they're eating instead of being focused on their relationship with food?

SPEAKER_00 8:15

Yeah, so good. And just for anybody that maybe is curious, um, I think you kind of described it as a whole, but like almond mom, right? Just being that like focus on right, healthy eating, or how would you describe it?

SPEAKER_01 8:28

Yeah, I guess I don't know. I think in the culture it can mean various different things. But I think originally it was like teenagers were going home to their parents, and their mothers would be like, Oh, are you hungry? Here's a handful of almonds, like, and them not being able to find like snacks to eat in their home. So I think that's kind of where it originated, and I think it's kind of spun off in many ways, but to me, it was kind of just like, you know, only buying organic or only buying non-pro like non-processed foods and really trying not to have the added sugar or food dyes or anything, like just being hyper-vigilant about kind of what your kids are eating, that's what it means to me.

SPEAKER_00 9:20

Yeah, I think so too. That overfocus on health, or we could put it in that category of like clean eating and that sort of thing, too. Yeah, absolutely. Um, and what were you noticing, if anything specific, when you say it was backfiring with your kids? Was it like you not knowing what to feed them? Was it their behaviors with food, a little bit of both, or what what made you feel like it wasn't really working?

SPEAKER_01 9:44

Um, the biggest thing was my kids' behaviors around food. I could tell that they were really worried. Well, the biggest thing is both of my kids are not, how do I put this? They're not really rule followers. They're not like I was at their age where I wanted to please my parents and kind of they will tell me when they are not happy with something and they will just do what they they will just steal stuff if they want it, you know, like they they're not happy, they're not afraid to break the rules in my house. So yeah, they were hiding a lot of food, they were stealing stuff, they were really hyper aware of it being at other people's houses, especially their cousins that we see very often, and really being like, they get this food, why don't we get this food? And then them just being really hyper focused on it, like when we went to birthday parties or when they went to friends' houses. So I think that was the biggest red flag for me was I could tell that they were having a bad reaction to the restriction that I was not meaning to put on them in a bad way, but I thought I was doing, you know, the right thing. So that was the biggest thing. And then also, I think personally, I think it was definitely stressing me out. And I remember one summer in particular when my kids were really little and we were staying with their cousins, and there was a lot of food that I didn't typically buy around my kids and around me, and I felt really stressed and just I just wasn't being the mom I wanted to be. So I think those two situations really stand out for me as like, okay, we need to really take a step back and figure this out.

SPEAKER_00 11:38

Yeah, for sure. Like, really think about what what we're doing here. I had a moment like that too, and my first was really young of like, wait a minute, how am I actually approaching food here? Because I was I was personally freaking out over a popsicle at my in-laws' house. And I'm like, why am I freaking out over a popsicle? Like, this isn't working, you know? So I totally get that. And I think it's really important in what you said, right? It's like we're coming from such a good and loving place and wanting to do what's best for our kids. But at some point we might realize that maybe it isn't effective and it's not really getting even the results that we want if our kids are seemingly obsessed with these other foods and fixated and you know, don't want to do other things because they're just paying attention to them, and that doesn't feel like it's in balance either or if it's causing anyone's stress. Yeah, I think that's really important and good for you for recognizing that and wanting to make the shift, you know, instead of just like we have to, we have to do this healthy eating thing, you know. Um so, in terms of how you support families now and trying to get kids like in the kitchen, I know that there are a lot of benefits to that, but what do you see as the main benefits or the reasons that families want to help their kids get in the kitchen or to cook together?

SPEAKER_01 12:56

Yeah, I mean, there are a few at the top of my list. The main one is that connection and healthy relationship to food. I think, especially at a young age, so many kids are labeled picky eaters and they are almost have this fearful relationship of food and especially of, you know, certain foods, especially, you know, vegetables or things that aren't safe to them. And my main goal with the younger age group, but really through all the ages, is to build a friendship with the food, to build a fun link that even if they aren't gonna eat it, it's a positive experience. You know, I really want them to have a positive experience with all different foods, all different textures, all different colors. And then later in life, they will maybe not particularly remember that one cooking class, but they will remember that, oh, that's not as scary as I thought it was. And so that's really my main goal, especially with the younger kids. As kids get older, my main goal is um to build confidence. I mean, at all ages, cooking definitely builds confidence, but and as they get older, really independence and learning to feed themselves, because even now, so many adults my age and older come to me and are like, oh, I never learned how to cook, and now I just order takeout, or now I just like am stressed about it all the time. And I don't want that for the next generation. I want them to be able to be confident in feeding themselves and their families and learn to have an exciting and fun relationship with cooking. And so many moms now are bogged down by the fact of feeding their family. And I think, what if they had that positive experience learning to cook? Like, how different would it be? You know, maybe they would look forward not every day, but once in a while, to make something that they hadn't tried before or, you know, stuff like that. So those are the two main things I think the independence, confidence, and also a positive connection with them.

SPEAKER_00 15:11

Yeah, I love that. And you know, it's so in line with even, you know, with division of responsibility. What Ellen Satter says is when the joy goes out of eating, nutrition suffers. I think, right? Having that joy around cooking and preparing food or just even just having fun with food, even if it's not full on cooking, but just not having, like you said, that like fear or tension or stress around it is going to help them eat a variety over time, want to explore food.

SPEAKER_01 15:38

So I want my kids to enjoy broccoli. I don't want them to have to eat it because they well, they wouldn't eat it if they didn't want to, but some kids definitely eat it just because they know they're being good and eating it because they're being a good kid. But like I want, I want them to really enjoy it. Or I want them to be like, oh, I don't really like it like this. Maybe there's another way I could try it, you know. So that's really my goal.

SPEAKER_00 16:04

Yeah, it's so important and just such, I think, so relatable for so many people. You know, I joke that I was like you too. I'm the people pleaser, so I would just do things to like make people happy. But my brother, on the other hand, was like a huge rebel and he wasn't gonna do anything that anybody told him. But neither one necessarily creates that like healthy, joyful relationship with food, you know, rebelling or just doing it to be compliant and and make everybody else happy. And and that's such a good point, too, around the like, maybe I don't like it this way, and that's okay. And it's okay if a kid never likes broccoli. Like, we don't all have to like every single food, but to also be open or want to maybe explore it in a different way, or find maybe it's not broccoli, but it's a different vegetable, maybe it's asparagus or cauliflower or whatever that then they could explore in another way. So I love the way that you put that. What have you found? Because I know you said that your oldest was more like picky or selective with food. Are there some things that you have found to be particularly helpful? And I know it's probably the whole, like what I talked about too, the whole environment, the whole ecosystem that we're creating around food. But were there things that you started noticing as you were kind of shifting the way that you were thinking about food that seemed particularly helpful in helping him maybe explore, try different foods?

SPEAKER_01 17:28

Yeah, I think the biggest thing for my kids was definitely removing the pressure and focusing on the fun. And I think it's really important to kind of learn your kid a little bit and figure out what's fun to them. Because I think all kids are, you know, so different. I'll compare mine. Um, my oldest loves art and he really loved getting creative with the plating of food or decorating the top of a yogurt bowl. Like if I sliced up some fruit and let him just put on put it on however he wanted, that was so fun to him. Where my younger one is not so much into the decorating, he wants to get messy. He loves the tactile, he wants to mix the meatballs, he wants to get it all between his fingers, he wants to do all the messy stuff and the stuff that might seem like a little bit risky. Like he wants to open the oven, you know. So you have to really get to know your kid and focus on the things that kind of light them up. Like, do they have a I always say with especially little kids, do they have a favorite theme or a favorite toy, or you know, like try to involve those things and get them excited? Because so many people are like, Oh, my kid has no interest in being in the kitchen. And I'm like, Well, that's fine, you know, but just start small and say, your favorite truck wants to add this ingredient to the bowl. Do you think you could help him? He really wants to try, you know. So, you know, you could just do it that way and incorporate their favorite truck, or yeah. So I think I think just finding little ways to make it fun for them and really focus on their particular interests is what my um go-to is when people are getting started with kind of helping their kids form a better relationship with food.

SPEAKER_00 19:30

I love that. And I think something that's really helpful about what you said is you're like, well, one kid more likes to, you know, decorate the bowl or something, which maybe like what what my brain's going to is maybe some parents aren't even thinking of that necessarily as cooking, right? That's just like, oh, putting food together or them making their own plate. But all of that constitutes is like getting in the kitchen and touching food or being around food.

SPEAKER_01 19:57

Yeah, it's as simple as like like transferring some carrot scraps to a bowl, or like, you know, it doesn't even have to be real cooking. It can just be washing one vegetable or you know, I really want to break it down for parents because I think when we think of cooking with kids, we think of, oh, we need to get the recipe, we need to prep everything, we need to have them get their apron and their cute chef hat on and take the pictures and be all cute. But real cooking happens every day in minute increments. If you just have them do tiny little things here and there, it really adds up. That's my main message when it comes to cooking with kids that one minute at a time adds up because I've seen how much that has added up in my own kids. My own kids are 13 and 11, fifth and seventh grade, they're in middle school, and they can cook. And I honestly wasn't sure I thought I was failing before they got there. I thought I was failing. I was like, my kids have not sat with me and made full recipes. Like on occasion, I have them help make one or two things for holidays, or I have a tradition where every Thanksgiving I have them pick out one dessert that they want to make and I try to have them do most of it. But for the most part, they've never really cooked a full recipe with me. I was like, I'm a cooking instructor and I specialize in cooking with kids and I might be failing here. But then little by little, I was like, they they can do stuff, like they can make scrambled eggs, they can, you know, make simple meals for themselves. And I was like, I need to tell people this because people don't know, like it all adds up. Like if you have your kids be comfortable in the kitchen, that doesn't mean they're cooking a full recipe. It just means they're doing a minute of stirring here. A minute of chopping next week, you know, and it just really adds up.

SPEAKER_00 22:06

And what a relief for parents to not feel like it has to be that full production, but their kid could be walking through the kitchen and they could just say, Could you stir this for me while I walk over here and come back?

SPEAKER_01 22:19

That's when you get into their particular interests. Like if my older son is like not wanting to help do anything where he's like 13 now and he really has no interest in helping me at all. But he, if I'm just like, Oh, I could you could like put the food on the plate or whatever, then he's up for it. Or, you know, if the little one is like walking by can be like, oh, I can't open the oven right now. Can you do it? You know, so play to their particular interests, even when they're older. And yeah, just I want parents to know that it just really happens little bit over time.

SPEAKER_00 22:57

Yeah, that's so great. I'm just reflecting too on things because I feel like, you know, as a parent who is busy and often just trying to get food on the table, it does feel daunting to be like, okay, and now I have to bring my kid in here when I already feel like I'm like zooming around and trying to get this plate here and this plate there. And I do want them to help, but sometimes it actually feels like it's a bigger chore or task to get them in the kitchen than it is for me to just do it myself, you know?

SPEAKER_01 23:28

Yeah, it definitely is. And I hear that from parents all the time, like, oh, I'm just too crazy at night. I can't um even think about them helping with dinner. And I'm like, yeah, I totally get that most of the time. I don't really and and even when they ask sometimes, I'm like, I have to take a deep breath and be like, yes, if you can help. Like the the rare occasion when my younger son wants to help, and I'm like, okay, yes, it might be a little frustrating, but it's beneficial to do it. Like, I have to tell myself that. But then also you have to know yourself. And is it better for you to plan a weekend where you know you want to make muffins and or have your kid pick out a recipe that they're interested in making when you have the time and you're not rushed? Like maybe that's better for you. So I would tell parents to think about the best way for them to fit it into their lives. It's not like a no one way works best for everybody.

SPEAKER_00 24:32

Yeah. And just hearing you say that, I was even thinking for myself, you know, sometimes my kids say they want to help and then they stir something and then they're like, I'm done, or whatever. And so, you know, part of it's like, I want them to cook and they seemed interested, but now they're not interested. They don't really want to help, but it's kind of just giving permission to say, like, maybe that's good and maybe that's useful. And now I don't actually even feel like I have to entertain them in there the whole time. They did what they needed to get out of it, helped me for a minute, and everybody can just kind of move along versus feeling like, okay, now they need to help me with this part and this part.

SPEAKER_01 25:07

It's definitely so frustrating when you're like, Oh, I'm so excited to make muffins with you. And then they're like, Okay, I'm good after like the first few minutes. So I always say to like definitely make something that you still would want to make if they leave, and to know that it's totally normal for kids of all ages to just get uninterested after a little bit and move on. Try not to take it personally. It happens to us all totally.

SPEAKER_00 25:37

So are there any, and I know again, this probably varies across what your kid is interested in and what types of foods, but are there types of foods or recipes that you find are one easier to get kids in the kitchen, or maybe easier for parents to even start with? I heard you mention like muffins, or I know on Instagram sometimes, like over the summer, you're posting popsicle stuff. It's like, are there certain things that you feel are maybe an easier entry point for a parent to start getting a kid involved, or even to start cooking on their own or making certain types of recipes?

SPEAKER_01 26:12

Yeah, definitely. Um, the first thing that comes to mind is smoothies. I have a whole smoothie kind of ebook online, and I feel like if your kid is interested in smoothies and likes smoothies, it's kind of a really easy and fun thing to do together and to make your own recipes, which I have a an online forum to help you do. So that's one thing that comes to mind. You know, baking is something that kids really love, and I've had some, you know, parents be like, oh, all my all my kid wants to do is bake, and they're kind of disappointed in that. And I'm like, just embrace it, you know, like that'll lead to other things. And really, it's all about what your kid likes and enjoys and gets excited about, other than just your everyday cooking where you're in the kitchen making dinner and you know they're learning basic skills along with you. Um, I would really focus on you know, weekends to maybe making pancakes, or that's kind of where I started. One of the my favorite things to make when I was young was making pancakes from biscuit mix, you know, like and I want to encourage parents to know that not everything has to be from scratch when you're cooking with kids. Like it's just as beneficial to, you know, make the pancakes from the mix or brownies from the box. Like they're still gaining a lot of skills and practical practice from those things. So, you know, not everything has to be from scratch. Try to make it as easy and painless for yourself as possible. And if that means buying stuff, that's totally great.

SPEAKER_00 27:50

I love it. I think, you know, it's really interesting again to hear you say this because you're like, yeah, some people can't even necessarily like, you know, cook when they get older or something. And I'm just thinking about how I certainly can make things from scratch. And we do, right? Like make brownies sometimes or make pancakes and and all of that. And we also don't. And something that I find interesting sometimes is like we'll go to a party and maybe it's a quick thing, and I do grab a box of brownie mix or whatever, and I make it at home and we take it, and people are like, oh my gosh, did you make these? They're so good. I'm like, oh, it's just a box, and they're like, like, they don't even do that, right? They just go and buy the store bought, which is absolutely fine. No judgment about that. But it's kind of the like, I don't even do that type of feeling, which is just like I'm hearing, right, having that flexibility, like having your kids be able to start with that means they have the ability and opportunity to be able to do that. And I'm thinking that's what's really important too, right? We all want our kids to feel like they have that flexibility and they have the ability to do things and to feel confident in it versus like I can't do it. Then they have the choice as to whether they want to or not.

SPEAKER_01 28:57

Yeah. And giving myself that permission too is oh it's been really beneficial too, you know. So that's what I want to model for my kids. So it was really helpful for me to discover that for myself as well.

SPEAKER_00 29:11

Yeah, it's so good to just have that uh permission. And I think there's so much, you know, pressure on parents to do all the like Pinterest ready, perfect looking everything from scratch things and say, no, like this is good too, you know, this is enough. So we've talked a little bit about the like picky eating piece. Um are there any like first steps maybe? Do you have certain tools that are helpful for them to use or certain activities in the kitchen maybe that they can do that are going to get them more involved that would be more of that entry point?

SPEAKER_01 29:49

Yeah, I think the most important thing for you can do for your kid at any age is get them a knife. So I think that's shocking for some parents. Don't give my kid a knife. No, but there are safe knives for younger kids, they're available and cheap on Amazon. I have a whole blog post on teaching your toddler or preschooler to use a knife, and I have links there. So um, if you need that resource, let me know. And it's right there. So the biggest difference I see in the younger kids um is A, they're exposed to lots of produce that way. We mostly chop fruits and vegetables, and toddlers and preschoolers are fascinated by grown-up tasks. So they are doing what they see as a grown-up task, and that gets them really excited. It's super challenging. Some kids face that really well, and some kids are like, nah, you can do it for me. And I do have some tips and tricks when it comes to both of those situations. Some kids are like, no, I'm doing it myself, and they don't want any help, and they might be holding the knife wrong. And then some kids are like, This is too hard, you do it for me. So those are both totally normal, and everywhere in between it all comes up. But I think teaching our kids to use a knife is probably the number one important skill we can help them with because the earlier they start, the more practice they get. And really, when it comes to cooking for yourself, I think the biggest lift sometimes for some people is you know, chopping that onion or the carrot or whatever. And if you start from when you're three years old, it doesn't seem that bad anymore. So there's definitely um a wide, uh, wide benefit to really teaching them those skills at a young age. And it doesn't have to be scary. You can do it, like I said, little increments at a time. I pre-cut things for young kids just so they can kind of just press down. I have a lot of videos on my Instagram showing the kids cooking classes and them cutting so you can see various ages using the kid safe knives. And yeah, don't expect a lot at first. It takes a lot of patience and practice. And I always say if they're tired, the best thing for you to do is do it with them hand over hand. If you can do that, if they don't want to do that, then they can just transfer the food into a bowl you're chopping and there and you're like, oh, can you just be the food picker upper and transfer it to a bowl? So there's so many different ways that you can have them learning to use a knife. So that's kind of my number one. Other than that, it's really just um, I have a bunch, I have a bunch of blog posts on different tools that I like for kids, but I don't want people to feel overwhelmed and think they have to buy a whole new set of everything for their kids. They you really don't. Um, just the kid safe knife when your kids are young and then they're happy to um at a young age, you know, learn to press buttons on suit certain tools is really good, simple way to have kids engaged at a young age, just teaching them um how to pr turn on the blender safely and how to push the buttons on a food processor safely. Yeah, just those simple things are really important.

SPEAKER_00 33:23

Um, I love that too. Sometimes, you know, even at a meal, I don't know what that's gonna necessarily happen with it, but I'll just put a couple kids save knives on the table with the food that's already out so they can kind of explore the food a bit more if they want or if they want to cut it into things. And again, giving them something to engage with the food so it doesn't just feel like I'm just supposed to eat this is great. So I love that. And I think that's overlooked, right? It's it's often the simple things that are overlooked, like just get them a knife. That's the the best thing you could do, the first place to start. Now, gosh, I have a couple of questions that I want to ask. So one is what if a parent does feel like I don't even cook at all? How do I get my kid in the kitchen now? Like, do you have any tips or recommendations for where to start with that?

SPEAKER_01 34:08

Uh um, first, I think sometimes the biggest hurdle is guilt. So try not to feel too guilty about you know your lack of experience in the kitchen and start where you feel most comfortable. If you um like we said, if you've never made a box of brownies, maybe start there. Or it's really individual. Wherever, you know, cracking an egg, if you learn the basics of that, you can teach that. I mean, cooking is you know, we take so much of it for granted. And I want people to know that, you know, making something in the microwave, start there, you know, like teach your kid how to safely heat something up, or you know, you can really start anywhere. And you know, once they get older, you can say, you know, I really didn't have much experience in the kitchen, let's get a cookbook together and start figuring it out, you know, do it as a project together. Um, start with simple recipes and learn together.

SPEAKER_00 35:19

Yes, I love it because that's like not where my brain automatically went around, you know, just heating something up. But I'm thinking, even for my 13-year-old, I mean Heather, it's embarrassing to say, but he is very like not efficient in the kitchen. My eight-year-old and 11-year-old are much more. But I think maybe being the oldest, maybe it's personality, maybe I babied him a lot, like not given him as much of that. And he doesn't do those things very much. Yet I could absolutely teach him how to make like ramen noodles, you know what I mean? Or like even a cup of mac and cheese in the microwave or something, just to get him started doing something that's a bit more independent.

SPEAKER_01 36:02

Yeah, I know. When my kids ask me, how long do I heat this up for? I'm like, you can figure it out. Start at 30 seconds and then figure it out.

SPEAKER_00 36:10

Right, which is so good. You know, you just saying that though, I'm thinking, again, reflecting back, I'm like, I'm very comfortable in the kitchen, but I think so much of it was because my mom was cooking all the time and baking, and I was just around. And so a lot of times people ask me, Well, how do you do that? I'm like, I don't know, just like put it in there and test it and then see how it went and then check again. Like, because it's just experimenting. Yeah. But it comes with that safe, that like sense what you're describing of just feeling comfortable enough to do that because you're exposed to it. So any bit of just being exposed, being able to heat something up is a positive thing. Cause when we're not familiar at all, it's just like trying a new food. When we're not familiar at all, that's overwhelming. But if we get them around those foods, if we get them touching them, if we get them comfortable in the kitchen, that barrier is removed then to be able to explore more. So I guess this was my other question, which we kind of just talked about. But I was thinking also, what if I do have a kid that's a bit older that's never been in the kitchen? So what I'm hearing is though, maybe start with just heating something up or some basic recipes. Do you have any thoughts about what, let's say, that tween early teen, I don't want to say should be able to do, but like, yeah, that's that's pretty basic enough that we could we could teach them that so that they feel confident being able to make something. Do you have any go-to's that are like eggs or you know, whatever might be a quick starting egg?

SPEAKER_01 37:38

I usually start with eggs if your kids like eggs. Like my my kids learned how to make like scrambled eggs or fried eggs, you know, at a really young age, and they use that skill all the time now. Like my oldest loves ramen, and he always puts a fried egg on top of his ramen. So they do that a lot. Um, you know, simple things like making a sandwich, a panini, grilled cheese, that type of thing. You know, it depends uh what they like. But um, I think I I see so many older kids that have a hard time spreading, and I think that that's a really big skill for them to learn. Like, um, it takes a lot more um fine motor skills to spread something than we realize. So even if your your five-year-old is having toast, like have them spread the butter on it, you know, have them do that one thing that helps them practice that independent skill so that when they're eight, nine, ten, they can make a peanut butter and jelly sandwich for themselves, you know. Um, and pasta is a little tricky because the w the hot water draining it is a little tricky, but I think if it's a small enough pot, they can start to learn to do that on their own if they're big like mac and cheese eaters or you know, a lot of cooking comes from um wanting. I think I try to let my kids want something so that they make it on their own. You know, there's certain like foods like the ramen or the mac and cheese, or you know, that I'm just like, yeah, if you want that, you have to make that on your own. You know, that's just not something I make for you. So I have certain things that as they got older, they're just weren't they just weren't things that mom made for them. They were things that they made on their own. So if they wanted that, they had to make it on their own.

SPEAKER_00 39:35

That's so good. It it reminds me of something that I often talk about with parents too, when we have certain boundaries about like what foods are available or not. Because one of my things in my home that I teach a lot of parents, if it works for them in their family, is like package snack options. Those are either things that I'm gonna put in a lunch or that I want to take when we're running out the door to go to a baseball game or something, right? Like a granola bar or something. It's never a hard and fast rule, but like in general, we don't eat those foods at home because we can make other things. So those are like to go snacks, packable snacks. And so I love even incorporating that same idea around certain snacks or meals you can make at home. Like these are things that you're capable of doing. So you can make those and then I make other things, right? Yeah, and obviously it's not a hard and fast rule with us either.

SPEAKER_01 40:25

Like if they're like really tired or something, of course, I'll make something for them. But for the most part, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 40:32

And I love that because it really fits with, you know, what what your big thing around cooking is, which I'm seeing so much more as we're having this conversation around that independence and confidence. How have you potentially seen that come out with your kids more or with other kids in building their independence and confidence?

SPEAKER_01 40:49

Yeah, it's been really fun and interesting to see as my kids getting older and having friends over. And I think I first saw it, it was probably like right after the pandemic. My friends, my kids had some friends over, and they're like, We want to make um, they call it a milkshake, but it's basically like milk and strawberries and vanilla. Like they one day they designed their own milkshake, and they were like, We can make our own milkshakes. You want to see the recipe? And they wrote down the recipe for their friends, and I like took a video because I was like, Who are these kids that are bragging about making their own recipe? Like they've never done that before. So it's been really uh fun to see like what they how they talk about cooking in front of their friends or with their friends. I really enjoyed kind of seeing that and them like making snacks with their friends or kind of uh teaching their friends stuff. Like I caught him like teaching them how to measure, and I was like, I taught him that. You know, so it's been really fun seeing that with older kids.

SPEAKER_00 41:59

Yeah. Oh, that's so cool. I love that. And it is it's one of those things that we sometimes forget how much that can also like just translate into life when they feel capable. So like giving them another area that they can feel, you know, capable and confident in.

SPEAKER_01 42:18

And I I enjoy cooking so much as a way to, you know, feed people as a gift, as a way to show people you care. And I that's something that I really hope for my kids is that I can give them the confidence that they feel like they can feed and care for other people in that way. So yeah, I don't know when I'll be able to see that in particular, but I hope someday that I'll see that with their own families in the future. I think I've, you know, I've seen it a a little bit in that they want to kind of have their friends come cook sometimes and involve their friends in that activity. But yeah, for me, that's a really important goal is to have them enjoy feeding other people.

SPEAKER_00 43:06

Yes, that's lovely. And I think it can be it's challenging sometimes. Like it's this whole conversation is really helping me step into wanting to promote that, you know, a bit more because I think it's so easy to feel like, oh, it feels like it's gonna be messier or more to clean up, or it's more ingredients, or it just feels like I don't have the space to do it, you know. But when we can actually think about what our bigger picture is, which is so true with food too. I always go back to like when we have the anchor that we really want our kids to have a healthy relationship with food, that can show up in so many other ways around being okay with them eating the packaged brownie because we want that flexibility. We want them to feel safe around it, right? So when we have this anchor of how it can, it can really promote their relationship with food, their connection, their intimacy. Independence, their confidence. It's like, okay, how can I look for even these little ways to include them a bit more?

SPEAKER_01 44:07

Yeah, the big picture is always something that I try to go back to when I'm feeling frustrated or when I really want my kids to eat vegetables. I feel like they haven't eaten like fruit or vegetable in like three days, and I'm looking at their plate and I really want to be like, please eat the vegetable. But I'm like, big picture, big picture. So I think that's something that you've definitely taught me. And um I hope to teach other people with the whole cooking piece is that when you when your toddler spills a cup of flour on the floor and you're just thinking, big picture, big picture.

SPEAKER_00 44:43

Yes, we need that in those moments where we're like, just breathe, right? With that, with that cup of flour, with those broken eggs on the floor. My gosh, yeah, I feel that. Um, I think maybe something you just said is where I'd love to wrap up a bit is when you said, like, okay, they're sitting there and you know, they haven't eaten maybe a vegetable in three days. And, you know, I'm sitting there thinking, like, okay, just eat it, right? And we all want that. Um, I think so many parents struggle with like, okay, what do I do though, in terms of like how to prepare vegetables or how do I make them more exciting? Do you have anything that you found that just your kids or more kids in general? And I know this depends on the child and their preferences, but that maybe does help with something like vegetables that tends to be a harder thing. Is it a cooking method? Is it a cutting thing? Like getting them in the kitchen with it, is this is it a certain cooking method? Anything that you have found makes kids like piques their curiosity or makes them a little bit more interested in vegetables.

SPEAKER_01 45:42

Yeah, there are a few things that come to mind. First is, you know, really having them use that knife and chop them. I have a like a rainbow fried rice recipe where the kids do a ton of chopping. Sometimes add pineapple in there for sweetness and color if kids like fruit. And then they sometimes use a fun, you know, one of those onion chopper tools to chop some bell peppers. So using fun tools, getting their hands on the produce, making it colorful and sweet. Those are a few things that come to mind first. That the I've had parents be like, this rice is magical because my kid has never touched this many or eaten this many vegetables. Because for many factors, I think being in a classroom with other peers and having a fun experience also has something to do with it, and their parents not being as involved in the feeding process definitely has something to do with it too. But I think those things are definitely some things that have helped with my own kids is not being afraid of like condiments and dips. My kids love dips, they love ketchup, they love ranch. My my little one's middle name should basically be ranch. He loves ranch so much. But I think giving yourself permission to let them use those maybe quote unhealthier condiments and not being afraid that they're taking away from the value that vegetables have in the first place. Um and you know, using, I think novelty is a huge thing. So maybe they get to use a giant fork to eat their carrot or something, or they get to eat out of one of their little play pots from their from, you know, if it's safe to use from their play kitchen, or they get to stack the cucumbers and you let them topple over and like, oh, push them over, see what happens, you know. So just being playful is a really big part of kids eating um more uh just a wider variety of food and vegetables in general. So I think those are some of my top things that come to mind.

SPEAKER_00 47:54

Yeah, that's great. Super helpful. Thank you for sharing that. And I think it is true too, I think in our culture, you know, a lot of times we think of vegetables as the healthy thing. And then when we do something to them, we're now suddenly somehow making them unhealthy.

SPEAKER_01 48:10

Use butter or cheese or salt or honey, or you know, don't be afraid to season your vegetables and make them taste good. It doesn't take away from their nutritional value.

SPEAKER_00 48:22

Absolutely, right? Like fat and sugar, those are things, salt, those are things that really do boost flavor, and especially for kids, can make it seem a little more exciting or or maybe similar to other foods that they already do enjoy.

SPEAKER_01 48:35

Like depending on texture, like a lot of kids really like roasted vegetables as opposed opposed to just sautéed or steamed. So my biggest tip is be experimental and have fun.

SPEAKER_00 48:48

Yeah, so good. I just noticed that last night I put just the green frozen green beans and took them and sauteed them in oil and, you know, put some garlic powder and whatnot really quick. And then I have noticed that my daughter likes green beans and she hasn't been eating them lately. And so I was like, oh, you know, and put some soy sauce and teriyaki and made them, and then she just kept sitting there eating them. I was like, ah, you know, here I've just been these were just labor change up. Yes, you know, like, yeah, so these were just in a room.

SPEAKER_01 49:17

We all get in those box. I do that too.

SPEAKER_00 49:20

Yeah. And it could be simple things. It was like not hard to just, you know, put that in the pan with it and and finish them, you know. And they're not, you know, perfect and gourmet, but it's like just some flavor helped. That's all that we needed, you know. So good. Um, well, wonderful. This has been so helpful. I already feel more permission, more motivation. Um, I really appreciate just the the simplicity around it. It's really, really helpful than feeling like it needs to be a big deal to get your kids in the kitchen and do this extra recipe or something like that. So I love your approach and I know it's gonna really help so many parents listening. So thank you. Um, I'm also excited to check out your smoothie. Um, what is it a download like a PDF?

SPEAKER_01 50:04

Yeah, it's a download. Um, I have a form at the end where kids can make their own smoothie recipes and take notes on what they liked about it so they can change it next time and everything. So it's a really fun and interactive kind of download for kids.

SPEAKER_00 50:22

That is so fun. Okay, I was already getting it. I'm definitely getting it. I'll go download it today and we will also link it in the show notes. Smoothies are the one thing my kids are so hit or miss because oftentimes we don't use a recipe. And so then sometimes they don't come out good, but when they're good, they like them. And so I'm like, okay, we need some recipes. And I love that idea. I often talk about taste tests and giving kids something to fill out so that they feel like they're involved and it's fun versus just like, I need to try the food. Um, so I love something that gets them involved and that they can make their own thing. So we will share that download for sure. We'll show your website where people can go find you. I have your cookbook, so we'll link to that because you have so many valuable resources for parents. So as we wrap up, do you have any last words or anything that you would like to share with parents?

SPEAKER_01 51:10

Well, yeah, thanks so much um for having me, Nicole. I love what you share. I think I share probably your Instagram posts more than uh anybody else's because I just love your perspective. And I wanted to thank you for everything you've taught me over the years. And yeah, when I started my Instagram page, um, one of my main goals was to try to not make other moms feel guilty or bad about themselves. So I really hope that comes off in what I share, and I want that to be my main message to all of you moms out there is like, don't let anything anyone sharing online make you feel bad. We're all doing the best we can, and you know, try your best every day, and that's all we can do, or not even your best, just just keep going because sometimes that best word is intimidating. But um, yeah, I just want to be a resource for anyone out there that needs it and also just a friend. So I'm here anytime.

SPEAKER_00 52:12

Thank you, and you do such a beautiful job of feeling so welcoming and non-judgmental. So thank you for being a space for all of us to go to so that we can, you know, have new recipes, new ideas for helping to get our kids involved in the kitchen. And thank you so much for being here today and sharing your thoughts and resources. All right. Thank you so much, Heather. I'll talk to you soon. Thanks for listening to this episode of the Intentional Table Podcast. If you get a second, please leave a rating, leave a review. That's one of the best ways to spread this message to more parents who also want their kids to have a healthy relationship with food. And let's remind ourselves, as we always do, that nourishing a healthy relationship with food is just as important, if not more, than the food itself. Thanks again, and I'll see you next time.